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gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Jun 5, 2009 10:04:53 AM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse Many stations require cash customers - anyone not swiping a credit/debit card at the pump - to come inside the station before pumping to leave a deposit, then return inside after pumping to collect any change. This widespread practice unfairly impacts those who do not or cannot use credit cards, many of whom are of modest means, perhaps unemployed. (It also impacts those who avoid debit cards, which benefit banks not the consumers who use them). But anyone, rich or poor, who has any money at all can get and use cash. The rationale for prepay policies is of course to prevent driveoff gas theft. But every retail business has to deal with theft, while no other business practice impacts honest customers like prepay policies impact gas station cash customers. There are several alternatives to prepay: - Cash accepting gas pumps, or kiosks near gas pumps. (Cash accepting kiosks are used by Arco in California, among others). - Full service gas stations! It's actually the law in NJ and sometimes used elsewhere, such as by the Swifty's chain in central Ohio. - Gas pumps that accept prepaid gift cards, if they are available inside the gas station for cash and immediately usable, with unused value available for later use. Usually they are brand-specific, and less than ideal, but still better than prepay. - And here's an idea -- lots of warnings around pumps, lots of video surveillance, and vigorous prosecution of driveoff thieves. cash customers should not be discriminated against, not when alternatives are available. But that is exactly what prepay policies do. Who will join me in avoiding stations that require prepay?

gas_too_high

Champion Author
Columbus

Posts:11,686
Points:1,959,415
Joined:Aug 2005

Message Posted: Jun 5, 2009 10:04:53 AM

Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse

Many stations require cash customers - anyone not swiping a credit/debit card at the pump - to come inside the station before pumping to leave a deposit, then return inside after pumping to collect any change.

This widespread practice unfairly impacts those who do not or cannot use credit cards, many of whom are of modest means, perhaps unemployed. (It also impacts those who avoid debit cards, which benefit banks not the consumers who use them). But anyone, rich or poor, who has any money at all can get and use cash.

The rationale for prepay policies is of course to prevent driveoff gas theft. But every retail business has to deal with theft, while no other business practice impacts honest customers like prepay policies impact gas station cash customers.

There are several alternatives to prepay:

- Cash accepting gas pumps, or kiosks near gas pumps. (Cash accepting kiosks are used by Arco in California, among others).

- Full service gas stations! It's actually the law in NJ and sometimes used elsewhere, such as by the Swifty's chain in central Ohio.

- Gas pumps that accept prepaid gift cards, if they are available inside the gas station for cash and immediately usable, with unused value available for later use. Usually they are brand-specific, and less than ideal, but still better than prepay.

- And here's an idea -- lots of warnings around pumps, lots of video surveillance, and vigorous prosecution of driveoff thieves.

cash customers should not be discriminated against, not when alternatives are available. But that is exactly what prepay policies do.

Who will join me in avoiding stations that require prepay?

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18wheelfixer Rookie Author Wisconsin Posts:2 Points:9,290 Joined:May 2011	Message Posted: May 13, 2011 3:00:12 PM Ignore 18wheelfixer Report Abuse It's not a matter of having to walk (so called exercise) to prepay for the gas. It's a matter of having to wait in line to prepay, pumping an amount that is less than what it takes to fill up my vehicle, and/or then having to wait in line again to get my change if I couldn't fit it all in. Banks want you to have a debit or credit card. It's one of their most profitable fee driven money makers. Myself I chose cash. Cash used to be legal tender but obviously it's valued less than plastic from gas stations. I had an idea once... I wanted to print up stickers to place over the Prepay stickers at the pumps. Reading something like "We don't trust you. We don't value you as a customer. Prepay for your gas and then get the hell off of our property!" That would stand out pretty well on every pump that requires prepay. I read a comment on here about lowering costs because of drive offs by having prepay. I'm curious which would costs more having an attendant pump your gas, credit card charges to the gas station from the credit card companies, or the occasional drive off?
srqmale67 Champion Author Sarasota Posts:1,163 Points:237,585 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Apr 8, 2011 8:35:24 PM Ignore srqmale67 Report Abuse otay
wes197 Rookie Author Hartford Posts:21 Points:155,070 Joined:Dec 2010	Message Posted: Mar 28, 2011 5:16:50 PM Ignore wes197 Report Abuse Here in Connecticut, every gas station I have been to in the last 3+ years or so has required cash customers to prepay 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Personally, I normally pay with a debit card. I can't imagine using a gas pump with a bill acceptor. That reminds me of all the times I've tried to using a vending machine that wouldn't take my dollar bill. I have been to New Jersey where an attendant must pump the gas by law. With high unemployment rates in this country and all of our manufacturing jobs going overseas, maybe its not so bad to create a few more entry level jobs. Just a thought.
mtnrambo Champion Author West Virginia Posts:1,481 Points:459,315 Joined:Jan 2007	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2011 3:56:14 PM Ignore mtnrambo Report Abuse pre-pay is the only way to prevent drive-offs... if it happened to you a few times you make them pre=pay also...
badbonita Champion Author Syracuse Posts:6,361 Points:1,380,435 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2011 8:45:33 AM Ignore badbonita Report Abuse Come on, change your mind set. Think about the walk into the store to pay, walk back to the car and then back to the store to get your change as a chance to stretch your legs and get a touch of exercise. Not just because of the weight problem in America but it's for your own health that you get up and let your blood circulate after sitting on your butt for however long.
cathychee Sophomore Author New York Posts:157 Points:39,175 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2011 5:36:36 AM Ignore cathychee Report Abuse well..for now it works, to put in cash accepting machines, or put an attendant outside to collect the cash would only raise costs..suck it up and just walk in and pay if you don't have a card
mnrick041 Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:14,477 Points:1,396,010 Joined:Jun 2009	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2011 9:06:52 AM Ignore mnrick041 Report Abuse I hardly ever go to a station that requires pre pay, that is because they do not do that where I live. Not unless you are filling your car up at 2 AM, and even then only a few stations require pre pay past a certain hour.
2fast4uBC Rookie Author British Columbia Posts:6 Points:261,245 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Mar 16, 2011 12:59:35 PM Ignore 2fast4uBC Report Abuse in our province its the law to collect payment before allowing customer to get gas. Some kid died chasing a drive off a few years back. Gotta love BC
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Mar 12, 2011 4:50:46 PM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse Maybe what is needed is pumps designated for cash customers so those of us who use a card can get in and out quicker! And to lessen the walk to the station, the cash pumps could be the ones closest to the store!
torinix Champion Author Maryland Posts:24,650 Points:1,149,110 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2011 7:01:57 PM Ignore torinix Report Abuse OK I have found an inconvenience at stations that require cash customers to go inside to pay. I hate to wait for them twice as long to fill up and move out of my way so I can gas up. Bring on the pickets and bull horns.
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 4:37:17 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse gas_too_high: Impressive; you have many more non-prepay than I would imagine. It seems that in smaller cities on both coasts and in parts of the Midwest and West there is a greater tendency to be "customer service oriented" than in larger cities, metropolitan areas for the simple reasons that the relatively small number of people go to the same small number of gas stations and gas stations recognize, if not know, their customers. If/when someone drives off, it's a known entity, not like it would be here in the D.C. metro area.
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 3:26:40 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse For those members interested in paying at the pump with their debit cards, you might be interested in the following news story today: JPMorgan Chase, one of the nation's largest banks, is considering capping debit card transactions at either $50 or $100, according to a source with knowledge of the proposal, because of interchange fees. Currently, every time you swipe your debit card, your bank charges the retailer an average fee of 44 cents, which it shares with its partners. Those fees add up to about $16 billion per year, according to 2009 data from the Federal Reserve. However, as part of the Wall Street reform legislation that was passed last year, these fees are being slashed. The Fed is currently proposing rules that would go into effect in July and would cap interchange fees at 12 cents. That change would cost Chase more than $1 billion a year. And Chase may not be alone. Other major issuers are also projecting huge losses from the interchange fee cap. Joe Price, president of consumer banking for Bank of America (BAC, Fortune 500), said in an e-mailed statement that the lower fee wouldn't fairly compensate the bank for the infrastructure and services it provides to retailers. And consumers would end up feeling the pain when Bank of America is forced to recoup costs "by increasing the cost of their everyday debit card transactions, limiting their payment choices, and impacting industry innovation," according to the email. Aside from mulling over a limit on transaction amounts, Chase is already testing $3 monthly fees on debit cards and $15 fees on checking accounts in certain states. Additionally, the bank announced in November that it has stopped issuing debit rewards cards. But a Bank of America spokesman declined to comment on whether the bank would cap debit card purchases at $50 or $100. If a cap like this does make its way into accounts across the board, consumers may have to write checks, withdraw cash from ATMs, or put their spending on credit cards. In a side story on increasing fees, Bank of America announced a $59 annual fee last month for some of its customers. That's in addition to any monthly fees that it might charge, reduction of "perks" and money returned from gas and other purchases. Basically they're saying that if they can't get as much as they want from your debit card, they'll reduce the amount you can spend on a purchase, meaning you make two purchases instead of one, and they can charge two transaction fees instead of one.
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 1:52:32 PM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse Gas_Buddy: "Just wondering, exactly how many (well, not exactly) gas stations do you have that are not prepay?" On the west side of Columbus there are maybe 5 stations that I know to be non-prepay, and based on brand and location, perhaps another 5 or so. A reasonable guess for the greater Columbus area would be 15 or 20 total. "And how are you defining prepay and non-prepay." Just as you would think: Prepay: requires cash customers (and plastic customers who do not use pay-at-the-pump) to make a deposit or swipe a card prior to pumping. Non-prepay: does not require any deposit or card swipe prior to pumping. Strictly speaking, I make exceptions for full serve (that is, attendants who pump your gas and collect at your car window) and cash accepting pumps or terminals, but neither exception matters here in Columbus. "Around here, there most gas stations that accept cash payment (and a couple that "require" you to see the attendant to pay with a debit card) are almost always a few cents lower priced than their competitors." Thanks, that proves my point about pricing and non-prepay stations. GTH
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 1:15:52 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse gas_too_high wrote: "In my experience, non-prepay stations have prices in line with, if not lower than, their prepay competitors in the immediate vicinity." Just wondering, exactly how many (well, not exactly) gas stations do you have that are not prepay? And how are you defining prepay and non-prepay. Around here, there most gas stations that accept cash payment (and a couple that "require" you to see the attendant to pay with a debit card) are almost always a few cents lower priced than their competitors.
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 10:26:38 AM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse "I use debit cards almost exclusively, but would not boycott a station just because it required cash customers to prepay. To me, that means the station is working hard to keep their prices down. " In my experience, non-prepay stations have prices in line with, if not lower than, their prepay competitors in the immediate vicinity. GTH
Michael29644 Champion Author Greenville Posts:5,139 Points:870,000 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Mar 10, 2011 12:15:46 AM Ignore Michael29644 Report Abuse I use debit cards almost exclusively, but would not boycott a station just because it required cash customers to prepay. To me, that means the station is working hard to keep their prices down.
pjhbac Veteran Author Montana Posts:426 Points:44,350 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Mar 8, 2011 5:41:24 PM Ignore pjhbac Report Abuse I try to use non-prepay stations whenever possible. There are several in my area. I only pay cash for fuel.
icurok Rookie Author Indianapolis Posts:31 Points:339,935 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Mar 7, 2011 4:46:22 PM Ignore icurok Report Abuse Sorry, there are to many people steeling out there! or they could just charge more to cover all the drive offs!! [Edited by: icurok at 3/7/2011 4:47:05 PM EST]
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 6, 2011 12:33:11 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse Two things: First, while I don't believe pre-pay is an inconvenience, I wish people would quit saying that getting out of their car to pay is a good thing because it provides the driver with exercise. That's not exercise, and it's not exactly stretching your legs. It's a simple 20 or 50 or 100 foot walk and back. That's not exercise anymore than cutting your toe nails is partial amputation, or buying a lottery ticket is investing in financial futures. Getting out of your (which you would do to pump your own gas) and walking several paces, is not exercise. Even if you do no other exercise, and you never walk anywhere other than from the house to the driver's seat and back, walking to prepay a cash purchase is not exercise. Minimum purchase amounts at the donut shop is not discriminatory. Stores are allowed, legally, to require a minimum of a $10 purchase before they have to accept a credit card (assuming the store accepts that credit card to begin with - not all businesses that accept VISA accept MasterCard or American Express, and not all businesses that accept American Express accept VISA or MasterCard). The reason for the minimum purchase is because of the low mark-up for many business, and their having to pay both a percentage of the purchase (generallly 2.5 to 3.5 percent) and a fixed transaction ("swipe") fee (generally 10 to 25 cents for each credit card swipe. For example, if you buy a pack of gum, the store has to pay both a percentage of the price to the credit card processor, as well as, perhaps, 25 cents; that could easily eat into any profit the store might make' that swipe fee doesn't hurt the business as much on higher priced/higher mark-up items. It's not discriminatory; it's simply smart business practices allowed by the credit card processors to help businesses that accept their card. If you want to say you're discriminated because they only accept American Express and not the card you do qualify for, so be it, but even that's not discrimination; it's business.
Stimpy2319 Rookie Author Mississippi Posts:7 Points:56,755 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Mar 6, 2011 10:52:40 AM Ignore Stimpy2319 Report Abuse I don't understand why prepay is so bad. Other than having to make an extra trip into the store which is probably a good thing (exercise) for anyone but the disabled. I think prepay is the gas station equivalent of those RFID tags that places put on products to trigger alarm systems when you walk out the door if they haven't been deactivated. Yeah it is a pain when some cashier forgets to disable them, but they help stop loss and keep prices down. Ok taking cash at the pump is a nice feature but I wouldn't boycott prepay stations. Oh here is an idea they could have a fast acting barrier to stop drive offs if you don't pay it pops up and the thief smashes their car up from running into it. That would teach them not to drive off again. Oh and if you don't think businesses discriminate toward credit/debit users then what about the donut shop I went to today that requires a minimum purchase to use a credit or debit card? This is a pretty common occurrence even at many gas stations. So I don't think the discrimination claim holds up. [Edited by: Stimpy2319 at 3/6/2011 10:55:38 AM EST]
torinix Champion Author Maryland Posts:24,650 Points:1,149,110 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 5, 2011 5:08:07 PM Ignore torinix Report Abuse " Sure, credit or debit cards are convenient. But credit cards are not available to everyone who drives, for financial reasons; and some people even choose not to use them extensively, to help them mange their money (or reduce their debts). And debit cards have their own problems. The bottom line is there are good reasons why some people cannot or choose not to use credit or debit cards, and these people are treated differently than credit or debit customers, no matter if they are honest or not. To me, that's discrimination -- not the invidious racial discrimination of the Jim Crow eras, simply treating different people differently, for no good reason (see my lead post for alternatives)." Credit/Debit privileges are just that a privilege not a right. If you are unable to use them for whatever the reason, that is your problem, not the station owners. If you "choose" not to use them, then that is your right, but you then subject yourself to however the station "chooses" to run it's business. The mere fact that someone is unable to obtain a credit/debit card should not mean that a business owner should be required to change it's business practices to accommodate that customer. A business owner should not be required to convenience customer at the risk of having their goods stolen. They should also not be subject to harsh criticisms for protecting their goods, any more than a person who is unable to obtain credit should be.
GasHunterIA All-Star Author Iowa Posts:843 Points:505,840 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 5, 2011 2:45:31 PM Ignore GasHunterIA Report Abuse Only if I have enough gas to drive to the next station.
Indypokerboy Rookie Author Indianapolis Posts:7 Points:7,290 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 5, 2011 12:15:38 PM Ignore Indypokerboy Report Abuse Swiftys still pumps the gas for you here in Greenfield Indiana.
cheapestgasNV Sophomore Author Las Vegas Posts:197 Points:29,235 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 5, 2011 6:31:40 AM Ignore cheapestgasNV Report Abuse Help stabilize world oil prices Ensure oil producers achieve a reasonable rate of return on production Ensure a stable supply of crude oil for consumer use. OPEC has a current goal of $27 US per barrel of oil.
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 1:43:04 PM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse Still spouting the same old lame arguments, gth. You have been told by numerous posters on this thread that you can fill up your tank with one trip to the station. Either you can't read or you can't comprehend.
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 1:38:41 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse Of course you could also say it's an inconvenience if you don't have a job that pays as good as another job and you can't buy the car of your choice to get to the gas station...but I digress. gas_too_high wrote: "...as a cash customer, you not only forego a convenience of pay-at-the-pump (which is available even at non-prepsy stations) but you incur an additional inconvenience at prepay stations." He adds: "...there are good reasons why some people cannot or choose not to use credit or debit cards, and these people are treated differently than credit or debit customers, no matter if they are honest or not. To me, that's discrimination." It's only an inconvenience if you want to think of it as inconvenience, just as it's an inconvenience to half to walk to the back of the supermarket to get milk, when it's one of the most frequently single items bought." It's like complaining that you want a pizza but the local McDonalds doesn't sell pizza and the local pizza place is further away than McDonalds. Everything has some give and take. Most of us don't consider prepay - if that's what the stores wants to do - to be an inconvenience. We can, if we want, give the cashier X amount and then if we don't spend that much, get our change, or we can make an intelligent estimate - as most of us are capable of doing - of how much gas we'll take and pay for that much. Granted, the second option won't guarantee an exactly full tank, and and some people here complain that they won't, then, know their exact miles per gallon to the third decimal point, but you can't have everything. Just as I can't buy Shell nitrogen enhanced gas at my local, lower-priced-than-Shell Washingtonian-branded gas station, it's merely some give and take. Bolondron: I think your perspective is correct; it's not discriminatory, and I don't even think it's inconvenient; I'm pretty sure that most people, during the course of a day or a year on a lot of other things than they would going into a gas station store once or twice a week at most. And welcome to Gas Buddy.
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 11:09:53 AM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse Bolondron: "This is an old topic, but I am truly confused as to how the prepay feature is discriminatory toward cash customers....Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see the discrimination? " Because this topic is old and mostly run its course, I haven't posted here for awhile, but this question deserves an answer. Paying with cash at a prepay station, when you intend to fill up, means 2 trips inside. Either that, or you just prepay for 5 or 10 gallons or whatever, and pump just that amount. Either way, as a cash customer, you not only forego a convenience of pay-at-the-pump (which is available even at non-prepsy stations) but you incur an additional inconvenience at prepay stations. Sure, credit or debit cards are convenient. But credit cards are not available to everyone who drives, for financial reasons; and some people even choose not to use them extensively, to help them mange their money (or reduce their debts). And debit cards have their own problems. The bottom line is there are good reasons why some people cannot or choose not to use credit or debit cards, and these people are treated differently than credit or debit customers, no matter if they are honest or not. To me, that's discrimination -- not the invidious racial discrimination of the Jim Crow eras, simply treating different people differently, for no good reason (see my lead post for alternatives). OF course, you may disagree. If you agree with me, avoid prepay stations, if you can. That's all I'm saying. If you don't agree, then don't. Thanks for asking the question. GTH [Edited by: gas_too_high at 3/4/2011 11:15:49 AM EST]
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 10:50:00 AM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse You aren't missing a thing, Bolondron. The entire topic is based on incorrect information and personal opinion.
Bolondron Champion Author Florida Posts:1,799 Points:284,190 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 8:35:57 AM Ignore Bolondron Report Abuse This is an old topic, but I am truly confused as to how the prepay feature is discriminatory toward cash customers. Other than the inconvenience of having to walk inside to pay, I don't really feel that is discrimination per se. Doesn't there have to be intent in order for someone to claim discrimination? It is faster and more convenient to pay with credit or debit at most stores anyway. Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see the discrimination?
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 4, 2011 8:21:05 AM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse "Flying J is a few more miles away...I don't mind buying there." If you're getting (honestly getting) 20 miles to the gallon, and it's a ffew more miles away...lets say three miles (whatever a few miles means), and gas costs $3.40 a gallon, that means you're spending 17 cents per mile on gas; if you're buying 10 gallons of gas, three "a few more miles away" to buy there, and a three "a few more miles away" to get back, you drove six miles or $1.02 worth of gas. That means you have to add 10 cents to the price of gas that you're paying. And you're certain that you're not buying "arab" oil?
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 3, 2011 7:08:50 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse gunnerWV: How, exactly, do you know where the gas came from that came from the refinery to the gas station? And how do you know that one station is selling only Arab oil, and the other station is not selling any Arab oil?
gunnerWV Rookie Author West Virginia Posts:6 Points:220 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Mar 3, 2011 12:45:59 PM Ignore gunnerWV Report Abuse I have found 1 gas station here in WV that is not prepay.Problem is, it is a Shell which is arab oil so I'am not buying from them. Flying J is a few more miles away and has a kiosk out at the pumps. It does not use arab oil and I don't mind buying there.
babygirlNC Sophomore Author North Carolina Posts:156 Points:48,815 Joined:Jan 2011	Message Posted: Mar 1, 2011 12:17:54 PM Ignore babygirlNC Report Abuse i use to work at a gas station and had a lot of drive offs so I think it is for the best......
CiVX Champion Author Oakland Posts:7,146 Points:1,383,385 Joined:Feb 2009	Message Posted: Feb 28, 2011 4:19:24 AM Ignore CiVX Report Abuse The kiosks don't work very well; I gave up on them.
iceman11 Champion Author Ontario Posts:2,715 Points:536,425 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Feb 27, 2011 10:30:34 AM Ignore iceman11 Report Abuse Allmost anywhere you travel in Canada/U.S is prepaid
jonlul Rookie Author Gary Posts:66 Points:69,640 Joined:Mar 2005	Message Posted: Feb 25, 2011 3:48:16 AM Ignore jonlul Report Abuse I don't think prepaying is that big of a deal, other than inconvenience. We're in such a hurry now a day that we don't want to wait for anything. I have seen pay at the pump cash machines in some states. I've tried them & I don't think they're really a great option. They're much like any other money accepting machine, like a carwash, vending machine etc. You have to insert your dollar sometimes several times before it can be read. I don't see this as something catching on national wide. It presents just as much of an inconvenience as it does to prepaid & pick up your change if you go under the amount you left with the clerk. My advice to people who do not use credit or debit cards is to pick up a gas card, put money on that card and use it as you go. It seems to be the best alternative. Therefore, you don't have to have a credit card and you don't have to worry about running into the store everytime you pump.
grandma62010 Rookie Author Chicago Posts:16 Points:11,850 Joined:Dec 2010	Message Posted: Feb 19, 2011 7:41:49 PM Ignore grandma62010 Report Abuse You have to pay either way .You dont have to go leave a deposit and go get your change. You can tell them a certain amount , pay, go fill your tank and be on your way. How does it affect the unemployed? If you dont want to use a credit or debit card you have to pay in cash inside. People have begun so spoiled and lazy that its an inconvenience to walk into a gas station if they have to. Useless complaining about trivial matters.
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Feb 8, 2011 2:00:52 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse If I can follow-up Duckmeat's comment: "One thing I enjoy about a small town is the station I use by the house is cheap and they know me, when I pull up to the pump even with the prepay policy they turn the pump on for me. " I don't live in a small town (my small unincorporated village not far from DC has a population over 30,000 people) but I regularly shop at several stations near me and at and at two a half hour away and, even though the signs say otherwise, a simple wave of my hand (and I don't know if they recognize me or not, they turn on the pump. And I do shop at one gas station, in the middle of Arlington Virginia, that is pump first; pay second.
MARIOWERX Champion Author Vancouver Posts:16,069 Points:1,666,485 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Feb 8, 2011 1:27:58 PM Ignore MARIOWERX Report Abuse GTH typed "As long as some gas stations don't treat us like suspects, I will go those stations and avoid the others" Will the distinguished GTH please explain what is meant and why GTH is so bothered by it and explain how it is a inconvenience to the public. [Edited by: MARIOWERX at 2/8/2011 1:30:38 PM EST]
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Feb 8, 2011 10:21:41 AM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse I think some here do not distinguish between security measures that do not inconvenience the public, and those that do. And, again, just a reminder: if you don't agree with me, then don't avoid those stations. No need to get bothered about it. GTH
Duckmeat Rookie Author Memphis Posts:38 Points:3,780 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Feb 7, 2011 8:33:52 PM Ignore Duckmeat Report Abuse I sort of agree with gas buddy. while I do hate anything or any one with the nerve to in convince me, seriously, I used to work very closly with gas station owners and I know for a fact that they make no more than 10cent profit on each gallon of gas, and the average is closer to about 3 cent profit on each gallon, it takes a long time to make up for that 10 gallons stolen. That being said you would thing they would treat cash customers like kings, many do by giving large discounts for cash customers especially with diesel good for me. Often gas stations make very little or no profit and even lose money on credit card sales. 2 years ago, I knew a guy that closed his 3 highest selling stations because he was bleeding money out of them, from credit card sales. He only kept open the stations that had mostly cash sales, cant blame him, and yes he had a prepay policy. One thing I enjoy about a small town is the station I use by the house is cheap and they know me, when I pull up to the pump even with the prepay policy they turn the pump on for me.
MARIOWERX Champion Author Vancouver Posts:16,069 Points:1,666,485 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Feb 7, 2011 3:27:57 PM Ignore MARIOWERX Report Abuse If you do not want to be treated like a suspect find a gas station that does not have these features. Takes longer to get change in some places due to security safes that time release money, having them scan your bill takes time, all of this takes time and may be perceived as time wasting. You are suspect at almost all retail places except Fantasy Island.
Gas_Buddy Champion Author Maryland Posts:26,197 Points:3,061,500 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Feb 7, 2011 2:54:18 PM Ignore Gas_Buddy Report Abuse Some gas stations have extensive security precautions such as multiple cameras, located all across the parking/filling areas, others have in-store cameras; some refuse to accept credit cards without a form of identification (regardless of what the card holder may think); some gas stations have a sign that says that they'll proof anyone they think is under 35 before selling cigarettes, beer, or lottery tickets. They're all varous forms of protection. Protection for the store becuse they don't want to take chances that someone will drive off, that someone will shop lift, that someone will use a false credit card, that somone underage will cause them to have their license lifted. Just as some gas stations - and bars, and airlines - will refuse to serve someone who they believe is intoxicated, not that they KNOW is intoxicated, but that they believe is intoxicated. Some gas stations, on the other hand, lock their gas pumps when the station is closed at night (meaning that potential customers cannot use the pumps), and others have steel fences or gates so their station can't be entered in the event that someone throws a rock through the glass. Sorry, but I can't fault a station that thinks, in it's opinion, that having customers pay in advance is in its best interest. Those stations realize that there may be some inconvenience, or perceived inconvenience. But, in their opinion, it's what they think is best for their station. I can accept that. Just as they have to accept the rules or restrictions or limitations that my company imposes on them if they want use my company. Avoid them? Go ahad; shop elsewhere. But don't give me "...But every retail business has to deal with theft, while no other business practice impacts honest customers like prepay policies impact gas station cash customers." Not every retail business is working off the same razor thin margin (the same margin - or less actually, because of credit card usage and fees) with significantly (and I mean SIGNIFICANTLY) higher operating costs than 50 years ago; not every retail business can be harmed as much by one shoplifting incident (called, in this case, drive-off). Just one drive-off by a "cash customer" not prepaying, one cash customer getting 10 gallons of gas, will cost a gas station about $30, meaning that a gas station will have to sell about 300 gallons more gas, will have to have 30 additional customers, in order to cover the cost of that loss, and that means selling about 300 gallons more gas, without profit. Sorry; but if a gas station thinks it's in its best interest to ask me to pay before purchasing, I can live with that. Will I join you in avoiding stations that require prepay? Well, depending on the time or circumstances, I might not shop at that specific station, but no, I won't join you in avoiding stations that require prepay. If the station will provide value for my money, and if it's convenient, I'll shop there. As for "- And here's an idea -- lots of warnings around pumps, lots of video surveillance, and vigorous prosecution of driveoff thieves." Just wondering, but if these "lost of warnings" cost extra money for the gas station, and the gas station needs to pass on those extra costs to the customer, meaning it's prices might be higher than the next competitor, will you be willing to pay "just a few cents more per gallon" to help offset those costs? Or will you still shop for the lowest price? And just wondering, how about avoiding debit card companies that put a hold on your funds if you use their debit card to buy gas? Will you join the movement to avoid using those debit cards, and those banking or financial institutions? And just wondering once more, will you avoid using credit cards that charge monthly or annual or membership fees if their already charging a percentage at the pump, and you're only using the credit card to buy gas? After all, there are groups that believe the above two issues are important when shopping for gas.
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Feb 7, 2011 1:36:48 PM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse "Mario, why should we be concerned about "cameras, safes, locks, counterfeit bill detectors, and security alarms"? How are we inconvenienced by any of those?" If I may Mario. These are all security measures, gth, just like pre-pay gas stations. I'm betting ght has me on ignore or totally missed the connection, Mario.
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Feb 7, 2011 12:41:05 PM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse Mario, why should we be concerned about "cameras, safes, locks, counterfeit bill detectors, and security alarms"? How are we inconvenienced by any of those? And what does Tatoo's signature quote have to do with this topic? GTH
MARIOWERX Champion Author Vancouver Posts:16,069 Points:1,666,485 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Feb 6, 2011 10:50:28 PM Ignore MARIOWERX Report Abuse Da Plane! Da Plane!
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Feb 6, 2011 10:26:09 PM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse Maybe somewhere in fantasy land, Mario.
MARIOWERX Champion Author Vancouver Posts:16,069 Points:1,666,485 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Feb 6, 2011 9:20:47 PM Ignore MARIOWERX Report Abuse So GtH where are you going to go that they do not have cameras, safes, locks, counterfeit bill detectors, and security alarms, they suspect all of us! [Edited by: MARIOWERX at 2/6/2011 9:21:14 PM EST]
gas_too_high Champion Author Columbus Posts:11,686 Points:1,959,415 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Feb 6, 2011 8:05:46 PM Ignore gas_too_high Report Abuse Gas_Buddy: "As Mario said, everyone is suspect." As long as some gas stations don't treat us like suspects, I will go those stations and avoid the others. GTH
scoutmaster Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:82,168 Points:3,281,170 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Feb 4, 2011 2:37:17 PM Ignore scoutmaster Report Abuse And all this extra security can be blamed on those stealing products and services!